General freedom, democracy, human rights, talks. Ad comments
July 17.2012
In the picture B. Choriyev with his family.
Hello Bokhodir!
First of all we thank you for finding the time and being a volunteer guest “Dunyo Uzbeklari”! Before we start talking, please give us some information about yourself.
B.Ch: Hello Ismat aka! I’m thankful for your invitation. My short resume is following:
My slogan: All my wealthy and healthy are for my country and its people!
I’m Bokhodir Choriyev Hasanovich, was born on the 31st of October in 1969 in Shakhrisabz region. I’m married with my wife Feruza, have two sons and two daughters which we all live in the USA.
After finishing the secondary school in 1986, I entered the Tomsk politekhnic institute evening department of Electro city and physics faculty. In same time studied in one year course of radio mechanic.
In 1987 began to work in the factory “Kontur” in Tomsk as a fitter.
1987-1989 Served in Soviet Army.
At the end of 1989 I got married to my wife, Feruza.
1990 -continued study and worked in Tomsk.
1990 -transferred studying to Tashkent State tecknic University (last politekhnic institute) day time department.
1994- Graduated from the University and began to work in science researches institute at the Ministry of Finance.
1995 – One of the founders of Uzbek- China joint company “Сувжихозгаз”.
1997- founded own private company “Янги Таъминот”
November, 1999- Our family bought 61 per cent of safety stocks of the Open Stock Company “Kesh” in Shakhrisabz region.
February, 2000- became the President of this company.
January, 2. 2001- Was arrested by the region procurator.
July, 6.2001- had been free in the court hall for the pawn.
2002- Was put into prison for 6 years by the verdict of Kamashi regional criminal court and was free by the amnesty.
2003- Joined to the Marat Zakhidov’s IOHR as a defender of human rights.
Fall, 2003- left this organization and joined to Surat Ikromov’s Organization.
2004- For the opposite policy opinions was taken out from this organsnization.
2004-founded “Birdamlik” People’s Democratic Movement
2004-now- have been living in as political refugee in the USA.
1st question: Bokhodir, let’s begin to talk about our telephone conversation which you had minded my position about the R.Lib after reading my impressions of Prague trip.
B.Ch. I will try to answer your questions with my ability. Some of your ideas in the articles from the “Prague memories” pursued me to call you. That’s why I decided to call you to share my opinion by this subject.
There are some of your ideas and my comments to them.
Quotation: “however, some “false” democrat opponents have been blaming (discussing about Shukhrat Bobojonov) and mainly all Bobojonovs in “Liberty” for being in one side with M.Colikh.” As you know, I and others have had conflict with Bobojonovs since the 2006. If somebody hadn’t been in one policy position or joined to M.
Solikh, then they wouldn’t have had access to the radio “Liberty” by Bobojonovs. M. Solikh and his colleagues call these people as spy of NSS. For Examples: Aygul Mamatova- she was the one wing of the party “Erk” , second wing was Samad Murod; Jahongir Mamatov also has been in opposition to M.Solikh from the beginning of his political activity; Abdurakhim Pulatov who had a conflict with M.Solikh too: Bobur Malikov –former chairman of the High Court and former Minister of Law who really has been lawful marked to the activities of M.Solikh;
His policy activity has run without supporting M. Solikh – it’s me, B. Choriyev- the leader of the BPDM; The president of the UOHR Abdujalil Boymatov; Usuf Rasul, a journalist who wrote many criticize articles about M.Solikh and many other active people and volunteers. Besides, many other people are censoring in this Radio.
That’s why we have fought against the censoring in the R.Lib. The people who didn’t support M. Solikh and his policy position are against the being in a dispute of one side radio reporters as well.
We are always in a position of the Radio’s increasing and broad in all spheres. “Liberty” is not M.Solikh’s and his supporters’ ownership.
The radio must be open for every organization, groups and person who fight for democracy and human rights. It would be better if “Liberty” in Uzbek learned to keep equal rights from the Russian “Liberty”.
Second question: If you allow me to ask the next question, did you have any benefice of the picket and discord actions against the censorship in the radio “Liberty”?
Did you turn out in a ridiculous situation in the eyes of our countrymen?
Of course, It might have been clear if that actions had been against dictator or undemocratic system?
B. Ch: The main actions against “liberty” radio are yet to come. Last time we couldn’t success good results because of our some “active members” mistakes. I believe, that kind of “actives” won’t be in among us next time.
Now let me count our successes because of our actions and picket:
1. Incompetent leader Sojida Jafarova, who couldn’t speak in Uzbek, was unemployed from the position of manager of the “Liberty”.
2. Illegal manager of the “liberty” were Bobojonovs and the radio had been free from them.
3. Hurmat Bobojonov should had been put into the position as a manager of the Radio but this declare was cancelled.
4. Alisher Siddiq has been employed as a new manager of the R.L ( But his coward character and incompetentness has been caused to raise more defects and blemish)
5. It had been begun to pay attention to the R.L and it’s big role in the struggle against the system in Uzbekistan because of our anty-radio actions and picket. And the west politicians have understood the great role of the L.
6. The budget of the R.L has been raised radically; it seemed some positive changes had been done in the R.L. But we see that the R.L has had chronic ill defects as cancel and it hasn’t been able to recover from it. I would like to emphasize that the role of all Mass media always has been great in the struggle against any dictator. We are strong democratic opposition; of course, rely on free Mass media in our struggle against Karimov’s regim. If “Liberty” let one group have speech in the radio broadcasting and others couldn’t have this opportunity, second side never get any success in its political struggle. When “Liberty” or other radios become loyal and just in their position it will be fast positive political changes in Uzbekistan. That’s why we need the just full condition in the radio “Liberty”. If we meet any obstacles in this open speech place we’ll do our legal best to withdraw them. We’ll continue our struggle until the radio ‘Liberty’ will be free.
Third question: How is your father? And what condition is he in? How do you see his future fate? All his wealth and house were confiscated, how does he feel himself?
B. Ch: His condition is satisfactory. All his wealth and his things were confiscated by the government and were not given him back, in contrary; he was punished to pay a big fine. My father is going on his struggle against the unjust position of the authorities. Nowadays my father’s own house, where he has been living for 24 years, is confiscated by the government and them putting him in more anxiety.
Fourth question: let’s come back to the politics again, you invited M. Solikh to the talk but he refused it with the argument that he did have anything to say to you. You were in cross and since you have conflicted with him. Please, be honesty, and answer; how do you think what kind of rivals M.Solikh and B. Choriyev are today according to their experience and popularity? Did you have any moral right for that?
B.Ch: Ismat aka! Excuse me, this question is not being asked by the point of democracy…. Uzbekistan Peoples movement was founded last year by the leader of M. Solikh. Before, “Birlik” people’s movement which was founded in 1989 had been changed into, “Birlik” people’s movement party in 2003. And no one in people’s movement had been left in the political field in Uzbekistan. Then, by my initiation, “Birdamlik” people’s movement was founded. We have been doing successful political activities for 8 years. It’s too hard, but we try to spread our activities among the people and try to introduce them our endeavors and movements. We succeed much but is Mr. Solikh informed about it? I would had liked to make some clear following questions as: Why hadn’t M.Solikh founded people’s movement before?
Where are his National Save Committee which he announced about by the R.L and “13 of May” union? How did he do to find the new people’s movement? What is the difference of the new organization from the “Birdamlik” People’s Movement? And to many other questions we should have get some answers during the talk with M.Solikh in front of auditorium if it had taken place. That’s why I called M. Solikh to discuss. All important problems, which had been discussed not only between me and M.Solikh, but also among the millions of people, “Liberty” radio listeners and internet readers, should have been informed. In front of wide society I called M.Solikh to the discussion. Every person if considered he as politician would get ready to the talk like in this situation. If the politician knows that he is losing, then that does not mean not to face your rival, but to show up for your reputation and for honesty of the supporters.
M. Solikh’s position was not fit as the politician. He proved he is arrogant and is in boastful position. He should be ready to have a debate not only with me, but with every reader or our represented people. His opinion: “He is not in an equal position with me, but the other are ” these arrogance expressions with disdain is ashamed condition for a person who considers himself as a leader of Nation and opposition.
Fifth question: Since the foundation of the “Birlik” P.M how much money have you spent to any people? Did you get any benefit? Or let’s change the question; have you been offended for lending money to anybody? Or have you been in a situation when you didn’t expect indecent demeanor by your debtors? Or is there anybody who has been yet thankful for your support? Or did you harm yourself for sorry fullness?
B. Ch: My answer to these questions; Since my moving to the USA for nowadays I spent more than $124 thousand from my own earned money on “Birdamlik” PDM activities. Besides me, my brothers also have supported our Movement and they continue do it nowadays. God bless us, our earnings are high and naturally, have spent money on the politicians more and more. If somebody abused me or lost my trust, I’m not angry with them or my friends who are in the political field in Uzbekistan. I will meet people with spread hugs if they come back and join us again. Some of them didn’t pass the support money to them, who worked in extremely hard conditions.
It will be enough if they gave money to them and return with a note that has a signature to me or to the Leader of “Birdamlik” in Uzbekistan M. Esankulova.
After that we, of course, will build a new relationship with them. We are glad for supporting a lot of our countrymen in emigration. We supported more than one hundred people who are in political emigration. We supported everyone in different sum of amount. We believed that the supported people, who needed our help, once would provide help to our Movement or be helpful to other people who are in immigration in first world countries. We hoped to help other political emigrants with much more seriousness. Unfortunately it didn’t happen. Some people who came to the first world countries, they deserted our trust and then began to slander us.
I think that they wanted to stop their relationship with us by that way so they succeed their wealth alone. I have been cross for not their unthankful demeanor or not for their dislike of joining us but for their none-political activities fighting against Karimov’s regime in Uzbekistan, their scandals in internet sites or having been lost in the first world countries. My fault was that not knowing the people’s psychology and nature. If I hadn’t made that mistakes we would have spent those money on ( f.e. publishing and delivering newspapers and magazines) other political events and been more helpful to our countrymen. Certainly, we will announce the list of their names with the debt amounts to our people when Uzbekistan is free from the dictator in future. I think, people should know who is who, who is real patriot or but other one is sly and betrayer. If somebody thinks that open heart help is not demanding or needs thankfulness I will not be agreeing with it, more of all argue that these people in emigration doing nothing for people won’t be able to be met as hero in Uzbekistan!. It’s better late than never! We are not going to demand debts but we ask them for struggle! Always struggle against Karimov’s regime! In this struggle they can join to us, or “Birlik”, or “Erk”, or other new opponent organizations. Let struggle! Then we can say that they are real heroes.
I would like to emphasize this fact that among the people whom we helped there are many conscientious and descent people too. For example, a writer Gafurjon aka Yuldashev who lives in Canada is. He was very thankful for our support and I thank him too.
Sixth question: Have you ever regretted for wasting money to indecent people instead of spending to family?
B.Ch: Never. But, I said on the top, it would be more useful if we spent on newspapers and magazines.
Seventh Question: I have been to Prague recently and met M. Solikh there. He had a good opinion about you. It didn’t surprise me, because he can blame somebody for something very seldom. Don’t you surprise this situation because you always blame him for disdain and arrogance demeanor?
B. Ch: I’m glad to hear good opinions of M.Solikh about me. But its politics, every politic should be patient to every blame. If somebody to blame Mr. Solikh for something then wouldn’t they turn them into a spy of NSS. During the 20 years M.Solikh has become enemy to him, who has blamed him for something and under the different pennames, issued articles about his rivals or opponents. Trying to defame his rivals with different ways. It’s not good for politician.
Eighth question: Please, speak about your family and children. How many brothers came to America? And what did cause your emigration to the USA?
B.Ch: I with my wife Feruza and our two daughters and two sons live in America. The Elder child is 20 years old and the smallest is 7 years old. The elder daughter Sarvinoz is a student at a University which she is studying law. Second daughter, Sevara, is majoring in Medicine. Elder son, Davronbek, is in 10th grade at a high school and the little son, Dadakhon, is going to a third grade.
Our family is big. There are 8 brothers and two sisters. We, 7 brothers live in America with our families. We are all political emigrants here. My brothers and I put forward to run a transport companies and manage them. We all drive Lorries. We have more than 20 trucks, and their numbers are becoming more and more every month.
Ninth question: Now let’s talk about the Uzbekistan policy. I pursued you several times that it couldn’t be won Central Asian and Russian governments with peace struggle. And you always had minded it. And now do you also have same position?
B.Ch: Yes, it’s my strong position. The Russian government can’t be failed with revolution. It needs to be planned with peaceful, struggle strategy in Russia, in contrary; the war may last for long wasting times, power and money. The situation in Uzbekistan is differing. Sure, it can’t be failed Karimov’s regime with violence and force. To wait for a revolution or Karimov’s sudden death is wrong way. We have only one way- benefit using the strong organized peaceful struggle strategy. I can be more open besides somebody’s being cross, may be by somebody’s opinion Karimov’s regime is very strong but there are some thin sides of this regime and we must do to act and impact there. I think that Karimov’s regime is a collapse and is going to ruin, in contrary, we, active members of opposition are very weak and smart less. We stand in one place without any shaking and wait for the commands like the zombies.
We all democratic opponents should join and move together and I believe that we can do more effective work in the fighting against Karimov’s regime. We have planned the strategy how to remove Karimov from the power with peace way.
I believe this way of fighting exactly will remove Karimov from the government.
If we don’t join, then the process can last long years.
Tenth question: Have you any connections with Uzb. Special services? Your last visit to Tashkent and some unusual things happened with you there is caused to ask you this question.
B.Ch: I never had any connections with this organization. When we knew that they joined us we didn’t have any trust on them and didn’t put any serious position, at last we expelled them shamefully. Some of them left us themselves and others are still among us and observing our activities. They always tried to privacies us. But our firm Principals and democratic movement obeying the law failed their provocations.
Eleventh question: Please, tell me only true, who can we call the Uzbek opposition leader today?
B.Ch: There are many people who think that only he is the leader of Uzbek opposition today. But none of them is recognized by opposition or by Uzbek people.
It seems to me the situation for a short time which make false leader by radio and boastful or for a short imagination. A real Leader should talk to people with discussions in mind.
A leader can’t elect him as a leader, but only people and society can do it.
Pay attention, now who can lead the opposition? Is it Our Gossiper Abdulativ Pulatov? Or M. Solikh who keeps two religions and separated from the society? They were recognized as leaders on the 90s. For 20 years they had been forgotten by people. They had already lost their leadership abilities. A Real leader appears during the important policy events when the fate of the country and its people is being solved. Now, it is slowly but also going to the policy process. The opposition is fighting. The question of becoming leader is coming to daily scandal. For Ex. when Karimov goes away from the government during the fighting for the power, at the last moment then we can see the real face of many people. Still we are the leaders of small organizations.
F.Ex. I’m sure that I’m one of the leaders of opposition too. Everybody think so.
It’s not declared or boasted myself as a leader. One example, in 1992 when Abdurakhim Pulatov left the country a very big policy organization with power was left there by him. Where is the last power of the “Birlik” today? Where are its thousands of members. Today we can see only Abdurakhim Pulat or Pulat Okhun in “Birlik”.
I can ask this question M.Solikh too. Please, compare the “Erk” party in 1992 and the “Erk” party today. Than it had more than 54 thousand members but today it has only 54 or less, unfortunately. I always argue many people by this question. A real leader must stay in the country. Many people mind it. They argue that Government can put them into prison or choke and kill. I think that government can choke or put into prison or may kill them. But injured head certainly would recover, if it is a prisoner, then might be free one day, if the leader killed then 10 leaders can be appeared instead of them, if 10 be killed 100 can be appeared. The most important thing is to have possibility to keep whole policy party and its ability of working. At least, none every government can bravely take decision to kill the first leader of opposition. Because It can be caused a big rising and discord by some opponent organizations and the people of the country, and the policy pressure by the international societies , and at last government can lose it’s power and manager abilities. You can ask me why I’m in abroad. I didn’t escape like those leaders who ended “Birlik” and “Erk”. But I took the name of “Birdamlik” from Uzbekistan with me. A few numbers of our members remote in the country and they are still working there. Nowadays only “Birdamlik” movement functions in Uzbekistan. For 8 years have been being in emigration “Birdamlik” People’s democratic movement became one a big policy organization. The most important thing is that we have a mighty strategy and that the idea of how to become Uzbekistan’s prosperity with peace way after ending Karimov”s regime. I’m ready to be with my countrymen in my motherland in time beside of any block and violence.
Twelvth question: Your fresh opinion about Islam Karimov. How do you think why the government hadn’t troubled your father for many years but today they have begun to strangle him?
B.Ch: Karimov is one of the former soviet leaders. He thinks that he can control democracy and market economy. He is very selfish, he believes that only he is true, cruel and sticks man. He has been still thinking that he has ability to become Uzbekistan as prosperous country and pursued to believe his colleagues around him. But Uzbekistan has lost much luck during his ruling and it is only his fault.
Now, something about my father, the government hasn’t troubled my father in contrary always struggled. This new obstruct is connected with the new khokim’s activity in the viloyat. The new khokim liked to “advise” my father and this incident became more widely.
Thirteenth question: Have your any officials or none officials contacts with motherland?
B.Ch: I have only none officials contacting with my motherland. All my contacts are only with active members of our movement.
Fourteenth question: Why isn’t Uzbek opposition joint around one person? Can you recognize yourself as Uzbek opposition’s leader?
B.Ch: I think the reason of the Uzbek oppositions are not united situation is because of the conflicts between Abd.Pulatov and M.Solikh who are old rivals to each-other and can’t be agreed in any position or any ideas. Besides, these two leaders follow people made these mistakes again and in results the separation had been increased.
If they had have put their ambitions away and united in one idea on time Uzbek people wouldn’t have turned out in hard living conditions like today. And Karimov had already retired and enjoyed of old man life. Unfortunately it didn’t happen.
Their big mistake was to leave their parties in hard situation in the country and escaping to the abroad, and second is rival position to each-other and lost their colleagues in parties. Of course, our people will accuse them for this arrogance demeanor. But they have still been considering themselves true and blame other people for it. Now next part of your question, yes, Of course, once I will be able to be recognized as the only leader of the Uzbek opposition. Until then, I have many duties to do. Have some mistakes, but I always work on them. The purpose of visiting Uzbekistan was to get ready to be the general leader of the opposition. To prove my readiness, I came back to the country for a short period of time. God bless me if I felt some pressure but I Visited Uzbekistan without any incident. Next aim is to pursue the oppositions to believe us. Somebody tried to know my visit Uzbekistan by connecting with NSS. It’s nonsense. If all the opposition joins me, I give a word to get Karimov away from the power with peace; I will put my life on it.
Fifteenth question: If once I become politician I will try to be the bright leader of Uzbek opposition if not I will give it up. Can you do the same action?
B. Ch: So do I. First of all I’ll answer the question who is the leader? Every organization, society, policy party, opposition, nation, people and country has their own leaders. Leadership is a big duty responsibility, unsafe honorary labor, heroism and service. It’s naturally that real leader’s life is not safety. F.Ex. Bus driver is responsible for 30 people’s getting their direction successfully. This fact generally shows driver’s leadership because 30 people’s life is also in his hands. If he is competent he will get the direction successfully. In contrary it may be accident or troubles on the way. To fight against Karimov’s regime is extremely serious duty. Today opposition must discuss the question about the leadership. My high dream is to remove Karimov from the power with peace. I was not strong enough alone. That’s why I Founded “Birdamlik” P.D.M. I lead it and naturally I’m a leader of this organization. My demands to be the leader of all the opponent organizations can offend somebody. It’s naturally to see the rival position of some people. Remember, as soon as we unite in our activity, Karimov’s government will get a quick failing. In contrary, this process can last for long years. However, we do our best to end our high dream – to remove Karimov with peace. Before during my policy activity I hadn’t had any aim to become leader or president. But leadership is contemporary demand. My aim is to see my countrymen in freedom and become wealthy and live prosperous life. Certainly, it’s important to be together with opposition on the failing Karimov’s regime. Without having leader it won’t be able to remove Karimov from the ruling. So like president, without becoming president of the country one won’t be able to do any reforms. If President and his team gathered with trustful and educated people, who are free of the corruption and can fight against the corruption, then people, who love own countrymen, work together. It will also be able to make good changes in Uzbekistan.
Specially for “Dunyo uzbeklari”